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MaiFy  
#1 Posted : Friday, February 22, 2019 6:09:55 AM(UTC)
MaiFy

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Hi there
When we work on jobs in Viacad our main focus are the drawings, but we have trialed using it as a collective file or mood board and sort of keep all the job files all in one place.
So we were importing photo's of check measure drawings, sketches and web clips and make notes etc. (I think Photoshop is good for that, but not technical drawings)
We use the import JPEGs tool.
If you bring in more than a few few photo's things start to get a bit sparkly. Thats alright if its towards the end of the job, it seems to remain fairly stable but we don't want to do too many mods to the drawings because it could all disappear.
So we have cut back on the expansive JPEG file approach a bit.
But the main issue is when we transfer a viacad file between 2 computers. We do it via the cloud or USB, but the problem is, the JPEGs go black or disappear or the drawings tend to become unstable. It seems like the JPEG is stored partly on the local computer and not all the information is included in the viacad job file?
It also happens when transferring pictures included in Symbols.

Just wondering if anyone else has the same sort of behavior?

In the attached picture you can see where the logo in the imported symbol has disappeared.

Edited by user Friday, February 22, 2019 6:12:49 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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jlm  
#2 Posted : Friday, February 22, 2019 7:30:49 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: MaiFy Go to Quoted Post
Hi there
Just wondering if anyone else has the same sort of behavior?

In the attached picture you can see where the logo in the imported symbol has disappeared.



Hi Mayfy,
I had the same issue and I replaced my pictures with simplified graphic artworks made on Shark...
Similar behavior happens with text along a curve : it is stored a strange way and gets messy when imported.
Tim Olson  
#3 Posted : Friday, February 22, 2019 9:43:54 AM(UTC)
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Can you provide an example file?

Tim

Edited by user Friday, February 22, 2019 9:44:29 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Tim Olson
IMSI Design/Encore
MaiFy  
#4 Posted : Sunday, February 24, 2019 5:00:19 AM(UTC)
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Hi Tim
Here is a recent one.
This is the logo we use that has gone.(picture test as above)
These days we tend to keep the drawing clean to the end then drop the drawing symbol frames in from the computer we are working on to print.
I found an old one that was what we were doing, but as I said it started to cause us too many problems so we don't do it any more, we only do the essentials.
I think we played around with importing smaller Jpegs, like about 900 x 1500 but it didn't seem to help.
We were kind of pushing it into a space that it didn't want to go but being able to use logos and a few smaller image props makes it a better product.
If we scale from a jpeg drawing we tend to delete the picture after we have scaled



Thanking you
Mark

Edited by user Sunday, February 24, 2019 5:30:51 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Added pics

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Picture test.vcp (207kb) downloaded 4 time(s).
gym bag shelving with images example.vcp (2,497kb) downloaded 5 time(s).
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MaiFy  
#5 Posted : Sunday, February 24, 2019 4:34:03 PM(UTC)
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Okay
Monday morning and my colleague who knows whats "going on" found a file for us.
another example

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Jeff Karen Kitchen TO SHOW PIC PROBLEM.vcp (307kb) downloaded 4 time(s).
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Tim Olson  
#6 Posted : Monday, February 25, 2019 4:17:27 PM(UTC)
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Hello Mark

Many thanks for the example files.

In each case where it is black, the actual image data is completely gone from the file. When we import an image file, we convert the format into our internal RGBA pixel array format. For display we then convert into the appropriate Mac/Windows display image format.

>>It also happens when transferring pictures included in Symbols.

Some operation has removed the RGBA array data from the object. I've tried to replicate but no luck so far. Based on your comment, I've been checking drag/drop of symbols containing an image.

Would you happen to have an example symbol containing an image?

Also, are you sharing files between Mac and PC or just PC?

Thanks


Tim

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MaiFy  
#7 Posted : Monday, February 25, 2019 10:31:58 PM(UTC)
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Hi Tim.
Thanks for looking into this.
I have attached files from the symbol files.
The fridge one has some hatching, and we have found almost anything with hatching in a symbol will soon make the file unstable. Try rotating the symbol and dragging with the gripper.
I will attache some picture of the file setup in my computer, below, (limit on number of file uploads) there seems to be a few symbol file areas, that might be something?
Thanking you
Mark

Edited by user Monday, February 25, 2019 10:58:06 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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Dishwasher.sfx (81kb) downloaded 3 time(s).
Dishwasher2.sfx (1,801kb) downloaded 3 time(s).
Top Callacutta Nuvo.sfx (1,004kb) downloaded 4 time(s).
Dryer F&P.sfx (1,249kb) downloaded 3 time(s).
Fridge2D.sfx (66kb) downloaded 3 time(s).

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MaiFy  
#8 Posted : Monday, February 25, 2019 11:38:21 PM(UTC)
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File paths.

Sorry, missed the bit about sharing on which systems, So its PC to PC

Edited by user Wednesday, February 27, 2019 4:45:13 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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MaiFy  
#9 Posted : Thursday, March 7, 2019 5:38:19 PM(UTC)
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Hi Tim
Did anything come of this?
Do you need more info?
Thanks
Mark
Tim Olson  
#10 Posted : Monday, March 11, 2019 12:04:28 PM(UTC)
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Hello Mark

We are unable to repeat. I've also asked the QA team to try and track it down in addition to myself and Todd.

If you have any more clues how to repeat that would be great.

Tim
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NWIR  
#11 Posted : Tuesday, March 12, 2019 8:17:22 AM(UTC)
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I have seen this same problem. The way I can reproduce it is the following:

1. Create a custom model-to-sheet template that has the picture in the title-block. Mine was a PDF not a jpeg. I believe that the PDF was imported into VCad that will become the template.
2. Put the model-to-sheet template in the directory with the other (provided) templates. On the Mac, this is in the application container in the Applications directory.
2b. You can now create model-to-sheet drawings using the new custom template. When you reopen these drawings, the picture appears in the title-block. All is well!
3. All is well until.... you change to a new version... such as from 9-to-10 or 10-to-11.
4. Old files, (Ones generated under the old VCad version), when opened with the new VCad version, will not show the title-block picture.
5. At this point, I will have to go and put the custom-template into the NEW VCad application. The picture does not reappear after you replace the template.
You have to re-import the picture to patch up the title-block.

I haven't seen this behavior with other "imported" elements, such as imported ".sat" elements. But, those have been imported in the the main part of the drawing, not through the custom model-to-sheet template.

-Jess

(on edit) Here is an example of an drawing created with an older version of VCadPro on a Mac. I don't remember if it was created with VCPro 9 or 10. When I open it with VCPro 11, the picture (a trombone) is missing from the title-block.

Edited by user Tuesday, March 12, 2019 8:23:24 AM(UTC)  | Reason: add example file

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thanks 1 user thanked NWIR for this useful post.
MaiFy on 3/12/2019(UTC)
Tim Olson  
#12 Posted : Wednesday, March 13, 2019 1:30:51 PM(UTC)
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Thank you Jess, that example and step by step was very helpful to repeat the issue. Checking into...

TIm
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MaiFy  
#13 Posted : Friday, May 31, 2019 8:29:36 PM(UTC)
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I'm not sure if this is relevant or a clue to this issue but in print preview mode you can see in the image that the symbol (being the border is missing)
The program is treating the symbols and graphics differently, (its not embedding or looking at the whole file as one unit, so the information is separately stored in another location.)
It still prints the border as expected but the graphic image is still missing.
Hopes this helps.
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NWIR  
#14 Posted : Monday, June 6, 2022 10:03:40 AM(UTC)
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Now 3 years later.... I am switching to ViaCADProV12 and I have the same problem.....

-Jess
posh.de  
#15 Posted : Wednesday, June 8, 2022 6:07:34 AM(UTC)
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avoid transforming (scaling/rotating/flipping etc.) raster data from inside Shark but do change it externally w/ your raster image processor only and import in the final state then.

For graphics artwork do in general prefer the lossless PNG format instead of JPEG to avoid artefacts around contained entities w/ hard contrasts, i.e. black geometry on white bg.

Edited by user Wednesday, June 8, 2022 6:11:11 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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NWIR  
#16 Posted : Thursday, June 9, 2022 9:17:36 AM(UTC)
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The problem is that imported graphics get lost under certain circumstances. One of those circumstances is when documents move from one version to another. The orig.poster's problem seems to moving document between machines (installations). I don't know how ViaCAD handles these import graphics, but somehow, they are getting lost during the transfer from one installation to another. That could be moving from one machine to another, or as in my case, from one ViaCAD version to another.

I provided a way to reproduce the problem 3 years ago. It is still up to the ViaCAD development people to fix it.

-Jess

posh.de  
#17 Posted : Thursday, June 9, 2022 9:56:17 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: NWIR Go to Quoted Post
I don't know how ViaCAD handles these import graphics, but somehow, they are getting lost during the transfer from one installation to another.


as Tim had already elaborated above:
Quote:
When we import an image file, we convert the format into our internal RGBA pixel array format. For display we then convert into the appropriate Mac/Windows display image format.


Seems that this mechanism still fails... not converting and embedding a proprietary own format in the file but just attaching the raster data as a BLOB in e.g. the common PNG format compatible with all platforms would allow to avoid an error prone conversion but use the already available graphics display output framework of the respective operating system (Mac: Quartz 2D / Win: Direct2D).

Edited by user Thursday, June 9, 2022 10:01:09 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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UGMENTALCASE  
#18 Posted : Friday, June 10, 2022 2:11:08 PM(UTC)
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There is a massive issue with anything to do with jpegs when printing out. I made my own borders with logos. They would randomly disappear, leave empty spaces, sometimes display a black solid square when printed.
It does the same when you try and do a drawing with textures, it turns the textures to a jpeg and you end up with some horrible mess when it pdf prints or comes out your printer.
I don't really know what it does to achieve this wonderous result but it's crap. I've ended up sticking them back in the pdf software.. Got bored of trying to get it to work right.
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MaiFy  
#19 Posted : Friday, June 10, 2022 10:38:13 PM(UTC)
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I'm still on version 10, but it shouldn't be an issue,....... Well the first JPEG was of the ISSUE Nov 1972 cover of playboy and lena was her name.
So jepgs are going to be 50 years old in 4 or 5 months.

I am poking fun but 50 years,
is old technology, you would think handling graphics would be one of the easier things to fix.
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