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ZeroLengthCurve  
#1 Posted : Saturday, April 12, 2014 3:54:50 PM(UTC)
ZeroLengthCurve

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Joined: 5/15/2008(UTC)
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Does anyone know which version of VCP or Shark already or will have:

-- Select Mask filtering by search?

-- Concept Explorer filtering by search?

-- Meta layer (on top of/beyond SM/CE) entities management?

-- Tags/Labels and Extended Attributes enhancement for layers' names, ie, extended identification so that geometry and other entities can be dealt with MUCH faster?

I have 10s of thousands of pieces of geometry or entities in my model, and I am getting really burned out on crawling up and down the tree.

Now, recently, I have had to revert to right-click-click-up/right-click-click-down on layers because Shift-Click-Drag just DOES NOT WORK!!!!! I think it is somehow sensitive to density of the layer trees. On small files, it seems to work. In my trees/branches, it is hit or miss. A couple of weeks or so ago, I THOUGHT it was working. It is not reliable. It just enters "edit" mode instead of going translucent and floating to a dragged location.

I thought I had read that VCP and/or Shark were getting a major layer tree overhaul.

What happened?

I am at the limit, and this is forcing me to consider SpaceClaim or FormZ, not because of just layers but different ways of doing things. I'd hate to leave Shark LT, but mental roadblocks from stress over layer trees are distrupting my work flow.

I need a layer tree that is as flexible as a spreadsheet and as powerful as a database. It does not need to have endless columns and rows, but it DOES need an ability to statically and dynamically search on and flag sets and subsets of data by color, volume, mass, name, date created, date modified, XYZ position, in-model-bounds/out-of-model-bounds (not model space, but the model, which implies the user needs an ability to "skin" a project so that items OUTSIDE of the vehicle/vessel/house/building can be treated as staged parts and not part of the geometry.


The layers module needs to become a real, underlying DATABASE that (definitely is not to mimic ms access, but just offer a plain, no-nonsense tabular view with some search, tag/flag, sort, export, and import abilities.

It needs to be possible to drag and move layers for reorganization as well as for analysis. In effect, there needs to be a cross-tab empowerment.

The layers module NEEDS to allow insertion of copied, cut, pasted, or importated layers whether by layer or branch. If the data are arrays underneath, then there is no reasonable or sensible reason they have to be limited to branches.

One reason my work load and delayed finishing of anything intensive is that when I want to reorganized the layers, it is bloody and stressful because I am so accustomed to workig with databases. I feel like melting or just disintegrating with every restart of a new drawing. I either strip down a drawing, or have to move/copy stuff to a new file and laboriously re-create multitudes of branches/trees/layers. It REALLY needs to be possible for the layer interface to have a sort of "cross-tab" manipulation so that the object model can be analyzed for completeness and granularity in management of it.
ZeroLengthCurve  
#2 Posted : Saturday, April 12, 2014 4:32:53 PM(UTC)
ZeroLengthCurve

Rank: Senior Member

Joined: 5/15/2008(UTC)
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My model has hundreds of layers. I do not know the actual count because I cannot find out how many layers there are. Verify/Object Counts does not say how many layers there are.

In one file I am looking at (reviewing past work to clean up the file for re-use), I can see:

Arcs/Circles 72
Groups 7
Lines 2257
Pictures 4
Splines 38
Solids 26
Surfaces 545
Text 86

All the others are empty.

I have a layer I named Proxy Geometry. It has 2452 items on it.

Things in Proxy Geometry are things like generators, panels, desks, and more. They have patterned shapes, meaning, all desks have the same shape, but labels indicating number or location.

Now, I want to color code them to make them uniform by type. Some are easy enough to grab visually. Some I have to deal with in the Select Mask. Some I have to hunt down and turn on or off in the Concept Explorer because so much geometry is on multiple elevations (Z axis positions) making it difficult to cherry-pick.

If I could search for and mask just for all geometry and text associated with "AC Plant", I could quickly change colors.

If I could add flags, I could make a flag for all AC Plants regardless of what LAYER they reside on. In fact, it is not always good, useful, smart, or friendly to myself to assign one generator to one zone (no way to flag zones) or one compartment (no way to flag compartments, except by naming the layer, which consigns the similar objects to deep and long names across/down tree), no way to search by mass/size.

I guess I COULD generate a BOM, then export it, then clean it up, then import it into Lotus Approach (easier to use than Access or even than spreadsheets), then find what I need, then scour up and down the CE, SM, and Inspector, but that is downright tedious in big models.

I am loath to chop up the model because then things sprawl over multiple files, making searching and syncing and tracking even more nightmarish.

I think Shark needs a major, major, MAJOR overhaul so that a meta-management layer tracks zones/areas/masses/geometry from a managers POV. Then, drawing view can be assigned or not, according to user needs.

The model space could have a concept of "zones" and "model limits", not unlike the aready-primitive "boundary box". But, boundary box has no "logic" that says what's not part of its contents. The layer tool would need to keep track of inside-and-outside-of-boundary-box geometry and text, too.

The CE, SM, and Inspector need to be overhauled so that the press of a hotkey or button on the panels can auto-scroll up, or at least pop up a meta dialog so that deeply-nested layers can be dealt with, managed, or just looked at. Right now, Inspector is non-resizable. With long layer names, I am always being forced to rename layers to accommodate Inspector. I know there is a pop-up scrolling list, but with all the layers I have, the navigate button is not enough. A scrollbar/elevator is needed.

Some sort of "Task" and "Intent" based meta layer labeling accomodation is needed so that users like me can work faster and not be interrupted by the realization that for 20 minutes we've been putting multiple pieces of geometry on the wrong, same layer. Sometimes, it is expedient to do so, when things are not overlapping in plan, profile, and even ortho view, and when things can be quickly selected and hidden or masked.

Overall, working in Shark is usually great, but sometimes I hit walls that can be programmatically redesigned. I bet half the registered users can benefit from some of the changes I have asked in this posting alone.
ZeroLengthCurve  
#3 Posted : Saturday, April 12, 2014 5:37:30 PM(UTC)
ZeroLengthCurve

Rank: Senior Member

Joined: 5/15/2008(UTC)
Posts: 993

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Was thanked: 43 time(s) in 27 post(s)
Something else about the Concept Explorer is that there is no way to mimic the ability of the Select Mask's ability to "make vanish" the Layer names of items hidden or deleted from a layer.

In the casee of the CE, it would be nice if there were the SM and CE a button to synch to and unsync from the SM.

Why?

My Layer structure is labyrithine. It is mind-numbingly deep and very tedious to hop up and down the CE. If I could "truncate from view" the layers not actively shown in the SM, then it would make it much faster to move geometry or rename or find and edit things when I am in an edit task mode. If I select 25 objets and invoke "show only", it is very convenient that the SM shows only the layers I'm using at the moment. (OTOH, others might say it would be nice to leave them present but dimmed or hatched over.)

Enabling the CE to mimic the SM wouldd also reduce the errors associated with working long sessions and burning out and inadvertently dropping geometry on the wrong layer.

If ever had money to build my own CAD system, this feature ability would exist. I do not know whether it does or not. But, if it does not, PLEASE, take and use this possible "prior art" posting of it and use it. I certainly will if some day enriched and able to build my own app.
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