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Steve.M  
#1 Posted : Sunday, July 6, 2008 9:20:55 PM(UTC)
Steve.M

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Hello,

Normally when adjusting spline control points, I would disable snapping, as it can be a problem when attempting fine manual adjustment, as the control point can be pulled/snapped to an underlying object. But it appears that end_point and mid_point snapping need to be enabled so that dragging control points is allowed (a bit strange)
Is there any other way to manually adjust the control points without having this need to have the snapping enabled?


Regards,
unique  
#2 Posted : Monday, July 7, 2008 1:10:38 AM(UTC)
unique

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Hi Steve,

Yes thats strange it appears you need to have at least MidPoint enabled in order to be able to move(by mouse) any points:confused:. You can however using the actual Move cmd shift the point but thats seems very wrong.

Anyone else seeing this ?

Also, How does one snap to a 'point' in ortder to be able to move it correctly. Vertex only appears when end & Mid points are enabled ?
jdi000  
#3 Posted : Monday, July 7, 2008 2:16:15 AM(UTC)
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Steve

When all snaps are disabled you can select a control point and use the arrow keys to nudge the points by a defined amount in the preferences arrow key nudge distance.


Jason
Windows 11, 10
unique  
#4 Posted : Monday, July 7, 2008 3:27:30 AM(UTC)
unique

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jdi000 wrote:
Steve

When all snaps are disabled you can select a control point and use the arrow keys to nudge the points by a defined amount in the preferences arrow key nudge distance.


Jason


Hi Jason,

That's good.

On reflection and having played more with moving cv's around this morning I think the tool works well....the only confusion IMO is why nothing can be moved without having certain snaps active but personally this wouldnt be a problem.

Tim: In the snaps window can we utilize the RMB for toggling just Endpoints or whatever instead of having to select and deselect each time?
Steve.M  
#5 Posted : Monday, July 7, 2008 4:44:22 AM(UTC)
Steve.M

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jdi000 wrote:
.........and use the arrow keys to nudge the points by a defined amount.......
Thanks Jason,
I had missed that setting. By default the arrow keys move the screen around, so did not think them multi-function.

Regards,
Steve.M  
#6 Posted : Monday, July 7, 2008 4:53:10 AM(UTC)
Steve.M

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unique wrote:
l....the only confusion IMO is why nothing can be moved without having certain snaps active
Hi Paul,

With all snaps disabled, the "on" for objects still shows (when the object is selected), and objects can be dragged around, that was a reason I thought control points would/should be able to be dragged with the mouse~ while snapping off.

Regards,
ttrw  
#7 Posted : Monday, July 7, 2008 11:28:10 AM(UTC)
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Yes, now you mention it, the spline tools (which I rarely use anyway), are quite confusing. The control point spline and the bezier spine appear to do nothing at all until until I double-click or press escape. How can I possibly know what I am supposed to draw, if I can't see it, or is that a clue to what is going on? :confused: :confused: :confused:
ttrw  
#8 Posted : Monday, July 7, 2008 11:35:08 AM(UTC)
ttrw

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PS, Guys any chance of displaying your computer details in you signature- like Jason and I have done, because if there are any bugs, there is no way of knowing whether that bug may be windows or OS X specific. :D
Steve.M  
#9 Posted : Monday, July 7, 2008 11:50:28 AM(UTC)
Steve.M

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ttrw wrote:
How can I possibly know what I am supposed to draw, if I can't see it, or is that a clue to what is going on? :confused: :confused: :confused:
I presume you mean the lack of real_time feedback of the creation of the curves?

There does appear to be limitations with Viacad with any sort of real_time feedback, be it creation of curves or adjustment of surfaces as example.
Is this a limitation within the program, or the OS being used,... currently I am on windows(XP)

Regards,
unique  
#10 Posted : Monday, July 7, 2008 11:59:23 AM(UTC)
unique

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Hi Steve,

Do you mean no dynamic feedback like when extruding something. I find that to be a huge drawback even though you have the ability to quickly change the history !
Steve.M  
#11 Posted : Monday, July 7, 2008 12:02:12 PM(UTC)
Steve.M

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Hi Paul,
unique wrote:
Do you mean no dynamic feedback like when extruding something.
Yes.
ttrw  
#12 Posted : Monday, July 7, 2008 1:37:50 PM(UTC)
ttrw

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Steve.M wrote:
I presume you mean the lack of real_time feedback of the creation of the curves?

There does appear to be limitations with Viacad with any sort of real_time feedback, be it creation of curves or adjustment of surfaces as example.
Is this a limitation within the program, or the OS being used,... currently I am on windows(XP)



It can't be the OS, because I'm having a similar problem on Mac OS X.
Also after creating a spline, and after selecting, after it has appeared, I then have to choose 'show points' (apple-d) to edit the spline. Would it not be better if the points were ready for editing directly after esc or a double click etc had been made? One more click outside the spline or another right-click de-selects it?

Tim? Any thoughts?
Steve.M  
#13 Posted : Monday, July 7, 2008 2:06:54 PM(UTC)
Steve.M

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ttrw wrote:
It can't be the OS, because I'm having a similar problem on Mac OS X.
OK, thanks.
ttrw wrote:
Also after creating a spline, and after selecting, after it has appeared, I then have to choose 'show points' (apple-d) to edit the spline.
Yes, on the PC it is ctrl+d

ttrw wrote:
Would it not be better if the points were ready for editing directly after esc or a double click etc had been made?
I would not like to see the control points auto display, as that could be a problem if the intention is to continue with multi_segments(due to need to split curves for crease/corner), but would welcome the possibilty to double click (as you mention) to bring up the control points (as currently double clicking the resulting curves as no effect) or have a second right click bring up the options with "show points" included (see note)



Note:
I would also like to see some consistency of the behavior of a right click at the end of curves. With control point curves a right click simply ends the current curve, with lines, a right click will end the line, another right click brings up various options (the second right click while in splines as no effect)


Regards,


- Steve

_______
WinXP pro sp2
ttrw  
#14 Posted : Monday, July 7, 2008 2:09:33 PM(UTC)
ttrw

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Steve.M wrote:
I would not like to see the control points auto display, as that could be a problem if the intention is to continue with multi_segments(due to need to split curves for crease/corner), but would welcome the possibilty to double click (as you mention) to bring up the control points (as currently double clicking the resulting curves as no effect) or have a second right click bring up the options with "show points" included (see note)


Sounds good to me. :)
unique  
#15 Posted : Monday, July 7, 2008 4:01:11 PM(UTC)
unique

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Hi Steve,

Quote:
Note:
I would also like to see some consistency of the behavior of a right click at the end of curves. With control point curves a right click simply ends the current curve, with lines, a right click will end the line, another right click brings up various options (the second right click while in splines as no effect)


Yup, I second that. Utilizing the mouse saves overhead in the UI so im wondering if a shortcut could be setup ?. Personally, Ctrl D works for me but I have a nasty habit of using F10 & F11 :D
ttrw  
#16 Posted : Monday, July 7, 2008 5:10:25 PM(UTC)
ttrw

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Paul, you can set up your own key commands in VC/ Shark in the shortcut window, found under 'file' in the menu.

fwiw, f10 and f11 are the expose keys usded in Mac OS X. These keys can't be turned off, so it would be difficult to set these as a 'standard'.

Tom
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Steve.M  
#17 Posted : Wednesday, July 9, 2008 7:38:46 AM(UTC)
Steve.M

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Hi Tom,

ttrw wrote:
......you can set up your own key commands in VC/ Shark in the shortcut window, found under 'file' in the menu..
I was just taking a look.
Is there any way to get a full list of the keys pre-assigned?
I was expecting that when you select a command in the shortcut window that it would show any allocated shortcut key, but it does not (on the various versions I am trying winXP). I did make a printout which (appears) to show all commands, but that only shows about 20 predefined keys, and (as example) show points (ctrl+d) does not show as assigned.


Regards,
ttrw  
#18 Posted : Wednesday, July 9, 2008 8:07:50 AM(UTC)
ttrw

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Steve.M wrote:

Is there any way to get a full list of the keys pre-assigned?


It would be good wouldn't it? I don't know what is assigned to what (apart from the obvious ones of course)- and a list would really help. Nick? Howabout it?

I'm still kinda miffed that us 'outside the USA' customers don't get a printed manual, and must send our pdf's to people like LULU.com :mad:

Stiil the nice price of the VC software irons out these niggles (just).

PS In software like Apple Logic Audio, pressing keys on the keyboard instantly highlights the function that key is assigned to. You can also print off the key commands.
Todd Quinlan  
#19 Posted : Wednesday, July 9, 2008 9:57:32 AM(UTC)
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The spline tool is a bit of a different animal when it comes to how to use them. To get instant feedback as you draw, Click a start point and let go of the mouse then move to your next point and click again and repeat, the line will draw from point to point as you go.
Todd Q
CAD Support Specialist
Encore Software/ IMSI Design
Steve.M  
#20 Posted : Wednesday, July 9, 2008 10:05:26 AM(UTC)
Steve.M

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Todd Quinlan wrote:
The spline tool is a bit of a different animal when it comes to how to use them. To get instant feedback as you draw, Click a start point and let go of the mouse then move to your next point and click again and repeat, the line will draw from point to point as you go.
Not quite.

When drawing (for example) a control point spline, you have to draw the first 3 points before the curve is drawn, you then move the cursor but there is no actual feedback in the change that will be made to the actual curve, not until you actually click the next point.
For realtime feedback I would expect the curve to follow the cursor point, so it gives you feedback of the curve before you commit to the point being made, not given a result after the point is place.
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